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Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

   
Joined on 31 Aug 2007
Total posts: 80

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Montag, 14. Juli 2008 17:10

To think of me.

 

You said - I believe that dancers who properly registered should never be forced to become members of another organization if they wish to participate in another dance organizations' open event.

 

This seems to say if you are a competitor properly registered with a WDC National Association then you should never be forced to become members of an IDSF National Association to dance in their open events.

 

I am glad to see you are opposed to the IDSF National Association's bans on competitors who are "on the other side"

 

Joined on 29 Aug 2007
Total posts: 93

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Montag, 14. Juli 2008 17:14

Think of me,

On some rare occasions you make some valid points. Like you have on your last post. But by and large sambatogo finds you inconsistant. Commonly with condesending overtones. This latest concern of memberships seems to be for you, about money. There will be many that agree with you we are sure. But for many others also, it will be about the right to choose and do as they wish. With out any fear of retribution from the IDSF or their member countries which you seem happy to support.

But your last statements were absolutely right, and probably one of the best statements you have ever made on dancesportinfo, and sambatogo is in full agreeance. "Competition is healthy", and "If you want to keep members, provide superior product and service." Great! Think of me you are %100 correct!! So what are you afraid of ? And suspicious of  with the WDC and its member countries?

Sambatogo believes that organisations like the IDSF should be in the bussinesss of sanctioning competitions that they are a part of. And not in the bussiness of restrictiong peoples basic freedoms in competitions that they are not a part of !

 

To Barry.

You have some excellent points there in your last post. Bringing some new insightful light to this sad situation. And yes, sambatogo realises that no organisation is perfect. And will point out  any WDC faults, as well as the IDSF ones where needed. Thank you for the recognition on that.

The political nature of Mr Kimmons public statements in his press release may come back to haunt him in the future. If these fine top USA competitors decide that the USA dance enviroment is too politically sensitive. They may decide to go back and represent the countries of their birth, or some other country of their likeing? Because not a single one of them was born in the USA. just like Mr. Kimmons. 

Sambatogo.

Joined on 05 Aug 2005
Total posts: 232

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Montag, 14. Juli 2008 20:46

 

Sorry about this.  I take time responding and when ready to post I am asked to log on  again,  and get only this scrambled message.

 

@quicktime2

 

 

It does not matter how  you put it.  Either the competition is Open,  open to all "properly registered"dancers, or  it is Closed,  and  admission allowed  just to  dancers  who belong to that  competition's  sanctioning organisation.

It is only expected that the participants abide and respect the house Rules governing the event, and if the Rule is that participants must kneel and bow to  let say IDSF  logo ,  so be it,  and if you are expected to  sing a "song of happiness",  you will be expected to at least move your lips.

If you wish  to be a guest in my house, I expect you abide and respect the house rules, mu house rules,  and you will be expected to  remove your shoes and  not to  smoke inside.  If you do not like it you have a choice to stay out in the cold, or not visit. 

However it  made my day brighter knowing you are  glad,  just note,   I made a  general statement and it applies  to all.    If  it  happens to fit  IDSF so be it,  I am sure it applies to many others.

 

 

 

@sambatogo

On rare occasion I may valid point ?  And you call me condesceding ?  You mean even a blind chicken find the grain - type of a comment ?  Even if true,  is it better to make a valid point just on a rare occassion, rather than make no point at all, resorting to just patting those you agree with ontheir back , encouraging them to go on ?

 

 I seek no congratulations and agreement. You may have missed the point  It is NOT about money,  in fact it is not about the money at all.

It is about the respect for other organisations to whom dancers belong.  Its about respecting the dancers.It does not matter if you require a payment, give out  free memberships, or request that your members wear a dog collar.

For dancers it has little  to do with the money, I believe.   ;The membership is a symbol.  Dancers who drop thousands for a single gown,  hundreds for lessons,  would not even wink to pay $25 for something useful.    What dancers object is the reason for the payment,  the hidden agenda  the feeling they are being taken advantage of,  they may feel disrespected.

For the organizations membership is all about power, control, and   fees are important, without moneys organisations seize exist.

If you spread Good Will you'll  receive it  back,  it is  like  looking in the mirror.  You smile, the image smiles back at you,  you grin,  a grin you get back.  You know the old action and reaction, in  opposite direction type of a natural law  ?    At the end people, and also organization get exactly what they deserve, and their ill conceived  actions, just like our own actions are like a boomerang.  It flies away,   sometimes you think it will never come back,  but it does,  and  it hits hard when you  least expect it.

It pays off to be nice.

Just as I responded to Quicktime2, I seek no approval.

Just because two people have some differences does not mean they must be enemies,  in fact they  may agree on many  things.  People are often not upset with the message, people get  upset with the  method, and delivery of the  message.  

I am surprised you are in agreement with Barry who, in my opinion has misunderstood rather confusing message. I completely agree with the poster who wrote  promise of recognition and cooperation does not mean USA judges would always be invited..

 I hope  WDC has a method of selecting judges randomly,  just as IDSF does,  so that everyone, every country  has equal opportunity to send a judge,  to judge fairly the way the  dancers want.

 

Again, sorry   about this &nbsp mess,   the forum does not like people loitering...

Joined on 29 Aug 2007
Total posts: 93

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Montag, 14. Juli 2008 23:07

Think of me

Sambatogo has made many points to this forum, and not just agreed with others and "Congratulating them" as you put it. Your message of beng nice, seems totally missed on yourself? Which you go to great lengths to explain.

But the issue at hand as you see it, is obeying rules. And that is fine

My point is.  You, any dancer or adjudicator should only have to obey the rules at the event or comp that they are at. Other words, not need to follow IDSF rules while at a WDC event. That is dictatorial, and against all levels of freedom of association. Against most countries democratic laws. As the IDSF are trying to dictate. As it has been said before many times by many people on this forum. Everyone should have the freedom to belong to what they want, and if that includes both the IDSF and WDC well then that should be allowed to be so.  

Also, I don`t consider any one on this forum my/our enemy. Just a difference of oppinion. So this enemy stuff could just be a reflection of where you are comming from, and your own attitudes?

Have a nice day!

Sambatogo. 

Joined on 07 Mrz 2008
Total posts: 40

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Dienstag, 15. Juli 2008 05:59

thinkofme

Please help me.  You  believe that you have greater intelligence than me and  understand content and words more readily. I accept that but please

What exactly have I misunderstood?

What is the purpose of the Press Release?

What was the message  the "athletes" wished to convey?

How do you interpret the closing words These WDC actions are truly malevolent?

How do you understand the word "malevolent"

What are these "malevolent" actions and how have the couples who issued the Release suffered as a result?

 

If you believe that this Press Release was the work of the couples why did they need an "author"?

 

Do you agree the couples have remarkable memories to clearly remember events 22 years ago.  

How you concluded there was no a hidden agenda and absolutely absolve the Vice President of the IPDSC of any ill intent with an accusation of a "malevolent" WDC? 

Do you believe this was not a "political" message? 

 

I prefer to be fair to all parties and to understand what goes on around us so please do come to my aid.  Of course if the President and 1st Vice President of NDCA responded to my mails that might be a further help but I do not expect this.  Those with something to hide habitually ignore mail too searching in content.

Joined on 07 Mrz 2008
Total posts: 40

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Dienstag, 15. Juli 2008 06:14

Earlier today I made a posting here as a result of private events.  After further thought I realise that I had acted in a rather immature way and therefore have deleted those words  I apologise to any person who might have read them and now wonder what is going on although I suspect few would even give me a further thought..

 

Joined on 31 Aug 2007
Total posts: 80

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Dienstag, 15. Juli 2008 08:31

Dear Barry:

 

I would ask you reconsider any thought of not participating in this forum. Come back in another name but this forum desperately needs people with background in dance politics that can shed light on what is going on.

 

This thread is an excellent example. Your initial post brought the letter to the attention of many who do not follow all the US publications. Your remarks were to the point and provided a good explanation of the facts.

 

I wonder if the letter by Kimmins is similar to the letter posted by the Canadian CDF organization who sent a post to this website, addressed to the world, and supposedly signed by a group of professionals. It turned out that the professionals had never seen the letter before it was sent.

 

In conversation probably any competitor would say he wished there were judges from the country he represents. To try to spin this into an attack on the WDC and WDC competitions is simply an indirect attempt to promote IPDSC and to try to elevate the competitions they support. It's quite pathetic really. And insulting. Do they think no one can see through this?

 

This forum at least provides a means of providing another point of view. Let's continue to give it our support.

 

Joined on 07 Mrz 2008
Total posts: 40

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Dienstag, 15. Juli 2008 09:13

quicktime2

Thank you for your words.

I admit I seriously considered leaving this forum for reasons which I will not go into in public.  However I shall continue reading and when I think it is appropriate make a contribution.   You can be sure of one thing any contribution which I make will be under only one name -   Barry. 

 

.  

Joined on 26 Mrz 2008
Total posts: 6

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Mittwoch, 16. Juli 2008 12:51

Greetings Barry,

I do not contribute a lot but I feel  your   urge  to tell    a secret  ,  or must we wait  and anticipate  an appropriate time  ?  

 

Have you promised  to anyone a confidentiality ?

 

Never Say Never. 

 

 

 

Joined on 07 Mrz 2008
Total posts: 40

Re: "Message from USAs Top Representatives to WDC World Championships"

Donnerstag, 17. Juli 2008 07:59

It emerges that I did not misunderstand but was far too astute.  There might be a 200 line rambling confused and saying nothing response somewhere else but no answers here.

I am quite sure that some members who read this article will make up their own mind and be consistent in their thinking.  That's good and healthy for the forum..    Some of the other ridiculous even disturbed behaviour will receive no attention or response from me.